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  • Toronto Cops Confiscate Guns in “Safe-city Initiative”

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    The Globe and Mail
    September 23, 2009

    • A d v e r t i s e m e n t
    • efoods
    Toronto police have seized 400 guns from law-abiding owners whose licences had expired or been revoked.

    Project Safe City saw police seize unlicensed guns within Toronto. Owners were given the option to pay to renew their licences and pick them up again, or to forfeit the weapon. The 400 guns shown yesterday were forfeited. None of the owners were charged.

    “This is a crime-prevention initiative,” said Superintendent Greg Getty of Toronto’s guns and gangs unit.

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    Be prepared

    Comment Rules

    102 Responses to “Toronto Cops Confiscate Guns in “Safe-city Initiative””

    1. arwijn Says:

      Great, if anyone falls for this they deserve to be helpless…

      Red Dawn 09 Reply:

      They are starting to strip away your protection now so prepare for what is coming and awaken all those you care about. Click my name for solid information with video’s,movies,blog’s,text and for when your brain is to overloaded and you need a short break games. Updated daily and newly awakened patriots welcome.

      Patriot_in_Arms Reply:

      Give it 1 year, & we’ll see the crime rate in Toronto double! I’d like to match up the crime rate, in any city here in the U.S. that prevents Gun ownership, to Switzerland, where every household has a gun! 98% of the people who commit crimes, with guns here in the U.S. are not suppose to have guns to begin with, do to their criminal records! Also, if our Justice system would do its job, people who commit violent crimes against others, would be dealt with properly the 1st time & would not be alive, or free to commit anymore violent crimes!!!!

      josh Reply:

      and by crime prevention, they mean crime-prevention-prevention.

      can’t have the slaves preventing the government from continuing their criminal racket.

      NKVD_J_W Reply:

      More J-w propaganda. Stop being White pussies and watch “Missing Links”.

      SlowTrainComing Reply:

      I wonder why they want to take our guns here in America but other countries have them like Switzerland? What is that about?

      Tcc Reply:

      Switzerland is a very independent country, have you looked at a map of the European Union? Switzerland is the only country that is not a part of it. right in the middle. Hitler tried to invade Switzerland and failed.

      Pardon? Reply:

      The Swiss have never been invaded for over 700 years. Every able man in the country is required to have a fully automatic riffle and to practise regularly shooting. Why do you think the Swiss banks are so popular. No way is that country gonna fall and they don’t even have a standing army. It is all 100% militia. In WWI, a German general asked a Swiss militiaman, ” What would the Swiss do if the German army attacked them?” The sissman replied,” We would all grab our arms, walk out to meet the invaders, fire one shoot and go home.” You see a militia is just for defence of the nation. The fact that every man in the nation is part of the militia makes their force far more powerful then any standing army.

      jhjh Reply:

      White devils are going to kill you!!!!!!!!!

      Vote Third Party Reply:

      Last time I checked gang members didnt register their guns. So they took protection away from the american people….maybe next time people will vote 3rd party and WAKE UP!

      http://www.Vote3rdPartyNow.org

      MadMax Reply:

      Malone Labe!

      AntontheGreek Reply:

      it’s “Molon Labe” (Μολὼν λαβέ)

      josh Reply:

      we cant all type greek. but i think he got it close enough to understand.

      how about the greeks?

      are they fighting to protect their right to protect themselves? They certainly impressed me with their demonstrations against the criminals in government.

      Ksatria Reply:

      Knives are now the weapon of choice. In close and personal. Given time you will see short swords and Bowie knives, walking sticks, hatchets and crossbows. There will be the consideration of using poison before long. Home made jelly gasoline and a handheld delivery system are easy. Fire cries and is very intimidating. No? For poisons, the cities outlying areas have everything needed it’s only a matter of preparation. Guns are old hat. The minds of the citizens are more dangerous than a gun in the hand. Those who did not pick up their guns “gave” those guns. Perhaps they have newer ones. :)

      Ksatria

    2. SPIRITBLADE Says:

      Whoa, my last-post is ghosted.

      Kinds like the fools who come to MY HOUSE, for MY WEAPONS.

      “Ghosted.”

    3. someone Says:

      What makes you think someone from a gang would give up their guns?

      ridiculous.

      Max Reply:

      Damn fools had a chance to renew their licenses. The rotten bastards who would take someones guns. Well I never had one and I don’t think I could get one now.

      Max Reply:

      Toronto cops are always grabbing guns and making a big deal out of it. I remember a gun shop owers being killed for having a signs that guns don’t kill people, people do.

      Was a spoon responsible for Rosy getting fat?

      Max Reply:

      Oh but to finish about the gunshop owner getting killed had to be a psyop just like Virginia tech and Colobine.

      Crankymon Reply:

      They’re grabbing the guns of folks who didn’t renew their possession licenses across the country. Best way to kill this GD re-engineering cancer – quiet non-compliance. Fact is, is that most gun owners have never gotten a license.

      THE DUKE Reply:

      Yes the spoon was responsible for getting Rosie fat, so take all the spoons from every body. And the spoons caused global warming as well, bad hair cuts and traffic jams.

    4. THE AGGRAVATOR Says:

      I will gladly pay a fee to keep my firearms, I will pay in FULL with Pieces of LEAD!!!!!!!

    5. Illinois Sons Of Liberty Says:

      Illinois sons of liberty. check us out

    6. Dev Says:

      What does confiscating lawful weaponry do to help keep us safe from the gangs and their illegal; automatic mind you, sub-machine guns?

    7. Caligula Says:

      If their licenses are expired or revoked, then they are no longer law-abiding citizens.

      suethedmv.com Reply:

      That’s BS. A license is only issued to do that which would otherwise be unlawful under the common law

      12AngryMen Reply:

      Right on. In the US, the 2nd amendment IS my weapons permit.

    8. One PErson Says:

      More like “guns for gangs” unit

    9. Kris Says:

      again ….this is simply a tainted story ….im for the infowar but this is just not the the truth of the story …i am from toronto and this is simply not the case

      D Reply:

      Can you please be more specific and provide evidence of what really happened? We are seeking truth here…

      Kris Reply:

      i tried to but they keep censoring everything i put up ….i have made 3 attempts to put up what really happend but infowar keeps bringing it down

      tdotdweller Reply:

      i gotta know… is it worse than it sounds or better?

    10. chris Says:

      im a black man in the hood,and the the govt has been taking our guns for ever… im prepared and i always tell my fam to get stapped for the war against us…it’s hard as hell to get a c.c.w. permitt in the hood, you better be perfect…. but the constitution does’nt look out for the poor,black,and brown so we need to. so i have and everyone i know i tell them to get strapped(gunssss) and protect your family, so when the shit hit the fan you can protect yourself

      Glurtch Reply:

      Amen, Brother. Protect your family. NO MATTER WHAT! The US Constitution gives you the right. That piece of paper is more important than and trumps and law in the books. 2nd amendment. hoo rah!

      snatchum Reply:

      Do you really need a piece of paper to give you permission to defend your life or the life of another? If we did not have the constitution, would you feel helpless? Would you allow a loved one to be murdered, while you watch and say “I cannot legally help you honey, so I will let the evil man kill you”. Survival is an instinct, defending someone other than yourself takes guts. It does not take a law to permit you to defend life.

      Glurtch Reply:

      The piece of paper defines our rights as citizens of the republic. I was making the point that the founding law of the land supports his right to bear arms. I was addressing his situation and how the real law actually supports it. I guess i could have written an entire dissertation on what i belive but that would have been needless. You have to look at the big picture Snatchum. Dont open your mouth for no other reason than to hear your self talk.

      snatchum Reply:

      The big picture?! The big picture is, somebody wants to harm you so you defend yourself! It’s called self defense Glurtch, and nobody in any country needs you to tell them that the law says you have a right to defend yourself. You said “Amen, Brother. Protect your family. NO MATTER WHAT!” Then you say in the very next sentence you say “The US Constitution gives you the right.” So which is it Glurtch, no matter what or because the 2nd amendment says so. The big picture is you have the right to life…EVERYBODY in the world…Not just in the US and not because the constitution says so. You are almost awake….abit more stretching and yawning and you too will see. Right now you are just farting sentences.

      Tcc Reply:

      Im a white man from the country and i couldnt agree with you more. im defintly STRAPPED

    11. hulk Says:

      Paying for protection, now where have I heard this before ??

    12. chris Says:

      hit my email if you cant understand im just tired of racist govt,taxes,no jobs,and white supremacy!!!!

    13. noob Says:

      anti gun people aren’t afraid of guns, they are afraid of real freedom…a person with a gun represents a level of freedom beyond their ability to control…either we are free or we are not free and if we cant own guns then we are not free…

      Mike L. Reply:

      I totally agree

    14. TechiePatriot Says:

      Let the cops/army here in the U.S. try and come “take” my guns. I keep a loaded Bushmaster nearby at all times at home nowadays and keep a loaded S&W 40 on my hip. THEY WILL end up at the wrong end of the barrels!!! I’ll shed my blood for this country just like our grandfathers did in the Revolutionary War!

      the bull shit movement Reply:

      Yawn. Boring. Heard it all before and it’s fuckin old.

      The cops and troops are dumb cowards and so is the patriot movement.

    15. NWO HATER Says:

      I am a firm hater of the NWO and all the gun restrictions that are coming into place for all you yanks…But I live in Toronto and I have to step in here and disagree with ALL the comment above…You’re all morons…I wont even bother getting into this discussion because explaing things to Americans is like explaining things to retards…In the end…What the fuck is the point, you wont get it

      D Reply:

      There are more than just Americans here. Please do enlighten us with the truth. By the way, you are obviously irrationally prejudiced against Americans – IMO no matter how bad it seems you can’t judge a whole nation by the actions of some.

      good guy Reply:

      Hey NWO Hater, what is your point then? I would like to know. By the way, it sounds like to me that we should not have registered guns in our possession, just unregistered guns. I was told by a police lieutenant to “never give up my gun.” I’m sure they probably have the registration fee so high that it’s ridiculous. Like “ok you can have your gun, but it will cost you $2000 per year to register it and you will have to submit to “our” psychological testing, which will include getting the mandatory flu shot, otherwise we will label you as a psycho.”

    16. Cold dead fingers Says:

      That’s what you get for registering your firearms, suckers.

      Here’s a “crime-prevention initiative”, put more guns in the hands of responsible citizens.
      TAKE YOUR CITY BACK!!

      roaddog6 Reply:

      cold—you are the winner.

      “Gun registration is not enough. Waiting periods are only a step. Registration is only a step. The prohibition of private firearms is the goal.” janet reno 12/10/93

      Arnold Ziffel Reply:

      Same for CCW permits.
      Now they have your names, addresses, picture, fingerprints, SS#’s and everything else they need to come get you. You now have an FBI file on you and are in databases of local, state and federal gov’t databases and everyone they share information with. They can track your whereabouts anytime you use your license, credit card, ATM card, change jobs, change residence, move to another state……..
      I moved 6 times in 5 years and the Social Security Dept. STILL knows where I am all the time and sends me my annual status report. I never informed THEM of anything. Ever!

      If that isn’t a sucker’s trap…….

    17. Greg Says:

      What guns sir we dont have none.

    18. From toronto Says:

      The registry is a cash grab and for them to know who has the guns. We don’t have the right to bear arms. So we need a lisence to have hand guns which also requires that a course be taken. So these people were like people who drive without lisences. They always say the the guns used in crime are stolen from legal gun owners so that’s where the crime prevention thing comes from.

      Also from toronto Reply:

      True, we also need a lisence to have long barrel rifles, not only handguns. I can’t even afford to go get my license immediatly, even when I have the time off work to go do the 2 day course (which is not required but you have no chance of passing the exam without), what with our 45% income tax we pay to the feds, and all the bills, at the end of he month, I’m telling myself, “damn I have to try to save some money next month and try to book my firearms course”.

      The good news is that the firearms courses are always full, I always see people buying rifles at the outdoor stores, it seems like people are arming up , seems people are aware that something is wrong.

      the bull shit movement Reply:

      Yea well people are always buying guns in america too but so what. Not one single patriot has made a stand. Not one.

      roaddog6 Reply:

      we can’t jump the gun. (no pun intended)

      scrambledeggsinthebrain Reply:

      Boy, the devil sure is working overtime….does he ever take a break?

    19. maria Says:

      Safe for who? This is totally illegal. When will people start filing lawsuits?

    20. Bob Says:

      test

    21. Bob Says:

      My intellegable response keeps getting censored… odd… what kind of infowar is this?

      From toronto Reply:

      I have had that happen too! You could be right!

      tdotdweller Reply:

      i think everyone has now… wtf

    22. Ryan Says:

      Guilty until proven innocent.

    23. Z Says:

      Mine did as well

    24. nondnabased Says:

      i do all of my work in this “city”. there are more sheeple here than any other “city” in the amercias. pls talk to 10 sheeple/day. remember you must use different facts, examples, and tools. each sheep is different.

    25. jg Says:

      they dont charge anyone with a crime here because its likely unconstitutional. it may have been more effective for the gun owners too refuse too give up their guns and too be charged, that way they could fight it via the courts.

      in ontario you dont have too pay any find if you plead not guilty.

      shame on the people who surrendered their weapons, i guess they will have too commit crimes with knives & baseball bats now. boy do i feel safer now lol

      hopefully this stays in toronto

      the bull shit movement Reply:

      Um, you ever heard of New Orleans? That’s right, not one, not one single tough talking bull shitting ‘patriot’ hard ass made the stand. 0.

      witman Reply:

      I agree. Where was the militia?

    26. coward cops Says:

      The ‘patriot movement’ in america will be turning their guns over to the troops, the hero’s.

    27. MrBeansC Says:

      *cought*buy from private parties*cough*

    28. shooter308 Says:

      Yes the gun grabbers are on the move but in small leaps and bounds,,,Texas seems to look at things a bit differently so far,,but we are stocking up on food, water , guns and ammo heavily and hiding it all.
      I suggest you all do the same.
      There are lots of police depts complaining they dont have ammo and lots of citizens i know of having plenty of it.
      I cant see all the PD,s being on the govt team but time will tell,,,,

      Funny how conpiracy has become news and news is conspiracy and lies.

      I bet the crime rate soars soon in Toronto if they keep this up,,its a proven fact . Ask England and the aussies.

    29. BoB Says:

      The safer healthy cites initiative is a WHO/ city partnership.
      Look up WHO safer cities, its all about cameras and a visible presence on the streets to deter bad behavior.

    30. Ron Paul told the truth Says:

      infowars.com

      henrymakow.com

      goodnewsaboutgod.com

      END THE FED by ron paul

      DID YOU KNOW INCOME TAX IS I L L E G A L !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      I AM SERIOUS there is no law allowing the IRS TO COLLECT INCOME TAX

      we need to wake the FUCK UP

      we NEED RON PAUL AS PRESIDENT

      and HE WONT NEED SECRET SERVICE TO PROTECT HIM

      five thousand americans can volunteer every week

    31. earl the earl of earl Says:

      Give Me Liberty Or Give Me Death
      Patrick Henry, March 23, 1775.

      No man thinks more highly than I do of the patriotism, as well as abilities, of the very worthy gentlemen who have just addressed the House. But different men often see the same subject in different lights; and, therefore, I hope it will not be thought disrespectful to those gentlemen if, entertaining as I do opinions of a character very opposite to theirs, I shall speak forth my sentiments freely and without reserve. This is no time for ceremony. The questing before the House is one of awful moment to this country. For my own part, I consider it as nothing less than a question of freedom or slavery; and in proportion to the magnitude of the subject ought to be the freedom of the debate. It is only in this way that we can hope to arrive at truth, and fulfill the great responsibility which we hold to God and our country. Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country, and of an act of disloyalty toward the Majesty of Heaven, which I revere above all earthly kings.

      Mr. President, it is natural to man to indulge in the illusions of hope. We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth, and listen to the song of that siren till she transforms us into beasts. Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those who, having eyes, see not, and, having ears, hear not, the things which so nearly concern their temporal salvation? For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst, and to provide for it.

      I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience. I know of no way of judging of the future but by the past. And judging by the past, I wish to know what there has been in the conduct of the British ministry for the last ten years to justify those hopes with which gentlemen have been pleased to solace themselves and the House. Is it that insidious smile with which our petition has been lately received? Trust it not, sir; it will prove a snare to your feet. Suffer not yourselves to be betrayed with a kiss. Ask yourselves how this gracious reception of our petition comports with those warlike preparations which cover our waters and darken our land. Are fleets and armies necessary to a work of love and reconciliation? Have we shown ourselves so unwilling to be reconciled that force must be called in to win back our love? Let us not deceive ourselves, sir. These are the implements of war and subjugation; the last arguments to which kings resort. I ask gentlemen, sir, what means this martial array, if its purpose be not to force us to submission? Can gentlemen assign any other possible motive for it? Has Great Britain any enemy, in this quarter of the world, to call for all this accumulation of navies and armies? No, sir, she has none. They are meant for us: they can be meant for no other. They are sent over to bind and rivet upon us those chains which the British ministry have been so long forging. And what have we to oppose to them? Shall we try argument? Sir, we have been trying that for the last ten years. Have we anything new to offer upon the subject? Nothing. We have held the subject up in every light of which it is capable; but it has been all in vain. Shall we resort to entreaty and humble supplication? What terms shall we find which have not been already exhausted? Let us not, I beseech you, sir, deceive ourselves. Sir, we have done everything that could be done to avert the storm which is now coming on. We have petitioned; we have remonstrated; we have supplicated; we have prostrated ourselves before the throne, and have implored its interposition to arrest the tyrannical hands of the ministry and Parliament. Our petitions have been slighted; our remonstrances have produced additional violence and insult; our supplications have been disregarded; and we have been spurned, with contempt, from the foot of the throne! In vain, after these things, may we indulge the fond hope of peace and reconciliation. There is no longer any room for hope. If we wish to be free– if we mean to preserve inviolate those inestimable privileges for which we have been so long contending–if we mean not basely to abandon the noble struggle in which we have been so long engaged, and which we have pledged ourselves never to abandon until the glorious object of our contest shall be obtained–we must fight! I repeat it, sir, we must fight! An appeal to arms and to the God of hosts is all that is left us!

      They tell us, sir, that we are weak; unable to cope with so formidable an adversary. But when shall we be stronger? Will it be the next week, or the next year? Will it be when we are totally disarmed, and when a British guard shall be stationed in every house? Shall we gather strength by irresolution and inaction? Shall we acquire the means of effectual resistance by lying supinely on our backs and hugging the delusive phantom of hope, until our enemies shall have bound us hand and foot? Sir, we are not weak if we make a proper use of those means which the God of nature hath placed in our power. The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us. Besides, sir, we shall not fight our battles alone. There is a just God who presides over the destinies of nations, and who will raise up friends to fight our battles for us. The battle, sir, is not to the strong alone; it is to the vigilant, the active, the brave. Besides, sir, we have no election. If we were base enough to desire it, it is now too late to retire from the contest. There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! Our chains are forged! Their clanking may be heard on the plains of Boston! The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, sir, let it come.

      It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace– but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!

    32. tonysc Says:

      “This is a crime-prevention initiative,”

      I wonder how many gang members they confiscated guns from. I’m sure most of them have them illegally. CHICKENS

    33. JACKSON AND NO BANK Says:

      this is why “shall not be infringed” is in our second amendment. when a gov’t makes you have a license to own a gun it is the first step in taking them away for good. “The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it.” Thomas jefferson

    34. Aussie Says:

      Since all the firearms were confiscated in Australia we now buy flowers and pass them around!

      Flowers are highly effective against intruders…many have been known to break down and cry when presented with a bunch in someones livingroom!

      A flower a day keeps crime at bay…yes thugs do have feelings!

      Lock and load or a nice arrangement in a vase…the choice is yours!

      .

      Flowers are the new weapon of choice!!!

      roaddog6 Reply:

      aussie—is it true you went and got vaccinated? Thats the rumor going around anyway.

      Aussie Reply:

      roaddog6:

      I have been vaccinated…but only because it was my mothers birthday!

      I hadn’t got her any flowers (it was after hours and the florist was closed) the Vacc’ clinic was open 24/7 and they were giving out bunches of roses with every shot!

      The only ill-effect iv’e had so far is gangrene…which started in my toes and has now covered both my feet…a small price to pay when compared to my mothers happiness!!!

      .

      Roses are red, violets are blue, iv’e had the prick, now you go get yours it’ll only take a tick!!!

      roaddog6 Reply:

      aussie—that was fucking funny man.

      Ben Ladin Reply:

      You are high-larious!!!!!

    35. 300 Says:

      COME AND GET THEM! LIVE FREE OR DIE. OH AND BY THE WAY!!! STOP SRAYING THE SKIES WITH YOUR CHEMTRAILS!!!!!!!!

    36. E@t@D1ck Says:

      Ummm at the beginning of the article it says the weapons were removed from people who had EXPIRED and REVOKED licenses. I see nothing wrong with that. Maybe I’m just misreading/misinterpretting/misunderstanding, but unless these people who had weapons taken from them were licensed (as in non-expired and/or revoked licenses) then I see no problem with this.

    37. 300 Says:

      Maybe there just sick of paying for something that is a GOD given right to protect themselves. Maybe they are just living by example of the true American belief that has been set forth for the US people. I wonder what Anne Frank would say about the right to defend and protect thy self.

    38. D man Says:

      Aussie! Just a word of advice, if you give a criminal that is breaking into your house here in america you will be pushing up daisies! Get it!

      Aussie Reply:

      Flowers are a form of reverse psychology!

      Greet the intruder/s with a bunch of flowers in outstretched hand!…ask in a sincere manner what material items are being sought…and then help in getting the items to the vehicle!

      Material posessions only serve to feed the ego…so it’s a win win…a win for the crim/s, and a win for you the past owner of material posessions!

      Hopefully you and the crim/s will part on good terms…and don’t forget to see that he/they depart with flowers in hand!

      Who knows…he/they could be the god parent/s of your children one day!

      Say it with flowers!!!

    39. Dont tread On Me Says:

      Isn’t it violating the 2nd amendment ANYWAYS by taking guns away?

      Crankymon Reply:

      In Toronto it violates Section 8 of the Charter Of Rights And Freedoms against unreasonable search and seizure.

    40. goodseed Says:

      I challenge you to print ten of these and give them to ten people that you know who are in denial about 911.

      http://www.thegoodseed.com/Wha.....On%209.pdf

    41. jhjh Says:

      White devils are going to kill you!!!!!!!!!!!!

    42. formerbostonian Says:

      If someone wants your gun and you know that you have not committed a crime,shoot them in the head.Now all we need is for tens of millions of people to feel that way.

    43. Jay Says:

      theres still plenty of guns 2 hours north of T.

    44. Ron Paul told the truth Says:

      buy crossbows and bolts buy bows and arrows

      buy swords and knives

      witman Reply:

      Check, check and check. Roger that!

    45. FatherPatriot Says:

      “This is a crime-prevention initiative,” said Superintendent Greg Getty of Toronto’s guns and gangs unit.

      It’s funny how no crimes had been committed with these guns during the entire time that these people owned them.

    46. witman Says:

      You suck so bad! Are you too stupid to make a website? You can link to your website in your posts. Nobody reads your crap!

    47. witman Says:

      RCMP has been giving out gun information to pollsters. It has also been reported that criminal elements might be using the gun registry as a shopping list. It’s less hit and miss if the criminals know where the guns are before they break in.

      Crankymon Reply:

      Exactly. That’s why taking those guns was a crime prevention initiative. The nice cops were just saving the registered gun owners from home invasion caused when criminals hacking into the registry find out the home addresses. Wasn’t that big hearted of them?

    48. John Q. Public Says:

      That is exactly why you DO NOT REGISTER YOUR GUNS ! !

    49. cactusoftruth Says:

      here in CA you are not even allowed to own a real assualt/battle rifle. has anyone ever seen a CA legal M4? you have to practically dissassemble the weapon to reload it beacuse, by CA law, the magazine -which can hold no more than 15 rounds- must be welded to the wewapon and not be detachable. sucks. so i just got a shot gun

    50. Crankymon Says:

      Cactus, if you want a rugged, proven battle rifle, but want it a handy length, see if you can find a .303 British Jungle Carbine. 10 shot capacity, with very rapid firing capability for a bolt gun. Cock on closing means you can keep it at your shoulder when firing. Magazine easily comes out and goes back in. Can use stripper clip if can find them. Getting hard to find them, although Gibbs Rifle Company makes decent Jungle Carbine replicas. Hope this helps.

    51. street soldier Says:

      screw that. I get a headache when i read all the bullshit going on in the country,an the stuff in nearby areas. everyone needs to stand up,and say, We will not go quietly!.

    52. street soldier Says:

      I’d say, it would be, essentially called a quiet Coup. Thats what it sounds like to me. Thank God for people like Joe Wilson,and Congress though.